Discipleship is an issue for us at Life on the Vine. We have a model that we’ve been struggling with once we
got bigger than 50-60 people. (We use a triad system where we follow a rule that combines Benedictine with Wesley). This morning, (or was it this afternoon?), Bob Hyatt, our ecclesia net buddy, taught us on discipleship. How do we disciple in missional communities? He gave us what he called a “minimalized” version of discipleship that cops some good stuff from Mike Breen.
In brief here are the highlights in bullet points.
He said:
- Following Matt 28:19 – church planting is the result of making disciples … not the other way around.
- If you are going to make disciples YOU HAVE TO INITIATE … “call people into discipleship.” You have to go to people and arrange for them to be discipled.
- Baptizing is not just the process of dunking somebody, it is the process of con-forming someone to the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
- “Teaching them to obey … all that I have commanded you” what does it mean “all that I have commanded you” It means to love God, love others. What does it means to teach people how to do that?
- From John 10 … “My sheep listen to my voice.” Discipleship is teaching people How to hear God’s voice and respond accordingly. SPIRITUAL GROWTH IS SHORTENING THE TIME … BETWEEN WHEN YOU HEAR IT .. AND OBEY IT.
- The problem with the “I’ve got 4 bases to run” approach to discipleship is it assumes an end, it assumes everybody is the same, and it is not reproducible. It ends up being too vague.
- Based on Mark 1:14-15, Hyatt followed Breen again and gave the circle of discipleship, a process that the discipler leads his/her apprenticeship through. It goes like this:
1. HELP PEOPLE SEE the Kairos moments in their life … when God/Kingdom is breaking through.
2. OBSERVE … Help people to observe WHAT IS HAPPENING … what’s going on in your life ? what is God saying?
3. REFLECT … understand the Why’s that are driving God’s work here.
4. DISCUSS … submit that to community …
5. PLAN … what are you going to do in response …
6. ACCOUNTABILITY … CHALLENGE .. + SUPPORT
7. ACT …
- The two questions that drive the discipleship process are: 1.)What is God saying to you in your life (today, this week etc.)? 2.)How are you responding – or what are you going to do about that? The way we use these two questions to drive the discipleship process in many faceted ways, I FOUND COMPELLING!!
OK, so that is about as brief a space as I can possibly put the whole hour and a half into. We spent about an hour fleshing this stuff out – how this process changes the entire orientation of Christian discipleship, the nature of the dynamic as one teaches discernment in communities of 3-10 people (huddle groups) and how it is reproducible. I am totally fired up. Thanks Bob Hyatt. Good work accomplished for the ecclesianetwork training week.
Talk amongst yourselves, I’ll hopefully take comments, questions, concerns in the comments. And I’m going to go try this out on J R Woodward right now who just walked in 
.
Anybody else know Mike Breen’s work want to chime in?
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Bob introduced me to the circle last year at the Ecclesia boot camp. It is the most powerful and elegant tool for leading Spirit-led discipleship that I’ve ever encountered, really. You simply teach people to listen and obey – brilliant.
We’re starting huddle groups this summer in our community, and praying that it results in a multiplication into new missional communities in the fall/winter.
I was introduced to Mike Breen's stuff via a local friend about 6 months ago. (3DM Websitehttp://tinyurl.com/2wuxlkv). Doug Paul (Ecclesia-no relation) graciously led a "leaders huddle" over the phone with Ben, Jim Pace, & a few other guys I was privileged to learn from. Being in a huddle with someone (Doug) who understood Breen's ethos was huge. Doug's own blog, "In Search Of A Movement", is well written and practical. (http://tinyurl.com/2c4zykf) He tells the brief story of his Richmond plant, Eikon, describing in great detail how the 3DM principles (i.e. the circle above) play out in their community.
In short, I can't recommend Mike Breen or 3DM highly enough. I think Breen could have built a traditional apostolic empire, speaking at conferences with the big dogs(I pray he gets these opportunities as God leads). Instead, he seems to have chosen to lay down his life for garden variety missional church planters like me, providing gospel-centered tools refined through decades of his own experience in the field. Breen has the goods.
BTW…thanks for taking some time on the phone with me a few months ago! It was helpful.
[...] Missional Discipleship from Reclaiming the Mission blog–”The two questions that drive the discipleship process are: 1.)What is God saying to [...]
Dave, you really ought to go on the weekend. Matt how close are we to this?
Dave,
I am just now considering a rule of life for a community to hold. What other long term effects have you seen? Is it working? Would you recommend this environment be created over a ruler-of-life environment?
Though I’m not familiar with the work of the two leaders you mentioned, their points look spot on! It occurs to me that — from just an epistemological point of view — the processing of these seven questions offers a substantial role to both non-linear and linear thinkers. Since I’m not aware of discipleship approaches that make a conscious effort to integrate both modes of processing, that in itself is significant. I think a strong case can be made for letting people from different epistemologies contribute to helping disciples process these seven questions. Hope the following thoughts spark some insights on discipleship from this angle.
From my studies and experiences, those among us who process information from a primarily non-linear, paradoxical approach are more naturally equipped to help others identify their kairos moments, reflect on them, and interpret them in the flow of their chronos process. Interpretation of details and action-reflection mode are generally more native to our thought processes. We tend to look at the here-and-now of happenings, and ask what God’s up to in this providential moment, and how we should view it in terms of overall goals. We help set the framework for future actions.
Those among us who process information from a primarily linear, analytical approach are more naturally equipped to help others strategize, plan, implement, and be held accountable for actions. Identifying details and practical steps, and theory-into-practice mode are generally more native to our thought processes. We tend to look at the here-and-now, and ask where this seems to be leading and wonder what kind of trajectory this is, and how to do incremental course corrections. We help set the framework for future reflections.
Representatives of both epistemologies working together make for far stronger communal discussion and discernment — as long as the community intentionally keeps in dynamic tension the perspectives of linear/non-linear, analytical/paradoxical.
When people from different epistemologies work together, it demonstrates better stewardship of the diversity the Spirit has implanted in our congregations. And that should/will make for a stronger discipleship process for individuals.
Cool …!
Would it be possible for you to post (or repost as the case may be) more about the triad system, benedictine/weslian rule that you use at LoV? Perhaps even including the guiding documents?
Very good idea, looking forward to making use of it.
Thank you so much >:D<
[...] the connection to the discipleship process, pointed out in a post by David Fitch HERE. Unless we train people to hear from God for themselves, they will always be dependent on human [...]
I dig the new look, Dave! Your blog posts will have that much more depth thanks to the aesthetics of your page.
From John 10 … “My sheep listen to my voice.” Discipleship is teaching people How to hear God’s voice and respond accordingly. SPIRITUAL GROWTH IS SHORTENING THE TIME … BETWEEN WHEN YOU HEAR IT .. AND OBEY IT.
All of this is great stuff, Dave, but I especially like this point! Love the new look, too.
[...] as we plant missional communities. It’s good and I’m glad I read the book, especially because I’ve been pondering the issue of discipleship a lot lately at our [...]
I think one thing I'd add (and I rarely see it brought up) is that discipleship is a LIFE not a program. As such life is messy, unpredictable, uncontrollable, episodic and (though this may seem obvious) takes a lifetime to live.
I'm new to the blog but I read "issue we've been struggling with" and the first thing that comes to mind is: struggling for how long? Months, years, decades, generations? I don't mean to criticize just bringing up a point.
[...] process on Mike Breen’s work (which a lot of others are doing as well: here’s Dave Fitch’s notes of Bob Hyatt’s talk on the same [...]
[...] Bob Hyatt talk about some Mike Breen stuff on discipleship. His basic contention, as laid out in this post (a presentation of the Breen stuff by Bob Hyatt) is that God is at work bringing in the Kingdom. [...]